Amazin' Avenue: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:



Around SBN: ANIMATED BLOGPOLL: WE GOT ALL YOUR COACHING MOVES RIGHT HYAH Bar-right-arrows



Aftermath: Game 2 - Mets vs Marlins

Well that sucked.

In the most highly anticipated Mets game since yesterday, the actual events of said game diverted from what could have reasonably been called "the plan". As such, I was wrong about a bunch of things I mentioned prior to the game. Those things included:

Pedro would be awesome

Even when he wasn't popping his hammy and was actually still pitching in the game, Pedro Martinez was something considerably short of awesome. He allowed four runs, four hits, a walk and a hit-by-pitch through the first two innings, digging the Mets a 4-0 hole that seemed insurmountable the way the Mets were swinging the bats early on against Rick VandenHurk. I was understandably optimistic about Pedro's performance heading into the game, but that washed away in a sea of red after he hit Hanley Ramirez and gave up a two-run bomb to Dan Uggla to start the bottom of the first inning. He got out of the first without allowing any additional baserunners, but got the second inning started on a sour note by coughing up a longball to Luis Gonzalez. Four batters later Ramirez tripled in Alfredo Amezaga and the Mets were down a Homer Simpson handfull.

To Pedro's credit, he retired the next four batters he faced before, you know, that other bad shit happened.

Pedro wouldn't get injured

Okay, so this one was really just implied by the previous point and not really something that I explicitly got wrong. Still, I'll man up and admit that I didn't see this one coming, at least not this soon. It was probably wishful thinking to believe that Pedro would make it through the whole season without missing a start, but I thought he'd at least make it to his second outing before going down in a crumpled heap. The early prognoses indicated a hamstring strain, but Pedro later described the injury as a "pop", which usually means really good things (read: really bad things) on the horizon. He will make his way to New York tomorrow to have some magnetic resonance imaging performed and we will all hold our collective breath awaiting the results. The best case scenario is probably a couple of weeks on the shelf. The worst case is a couple of months. I hope.

The bottom half of the lineup would suck

They sucked yesterday, and a little something called "recent historical empirical evidence" suggested that they would continue to suck. But there they were, miraculously not sucking. The bottom four -- Carlos Delgado, Ryan Church, Angel Pagan and Brian Schneider -- combined to go 6-for-15 with four walks (that's ten times on base in 19 chances). Pagan even threw in a sacrifice fly for good measure. By comparison, the top four spots in the lineup went 3-for-16 with three walks (two by Carlos Beltran, who was hitless otherwise).

Some other miscellaneous thoughts...

Aaron Heilman was great, striking out two in two innings and looking unhittable (duh!) in striking out Amezaga and Brett Carroll to end the eighth inning.

  • Matt Wise threw a bad pitch. He struck out the first two batters to face him in the bottom of the tenth, got squeezed a little on the first two pitches to Robert Andino, and then served up a floating meatball that Andino -- he of 36 homeruns in 2,810 career minor league plate-apps -- completely destroyed, depositing it into the left field bleachers for the 5-4 walk-off win.
  • I was only a little surprised that we saw Wise -- and not Billy Wagner -- in the tenth. I guess on the road Willie Randolph is always looking for a way to get Wagner a save opportunity, and might only be inclined to use him beforehand if the game is going into the 17th inning. It's easy to second-guess, but seemingly just as easy to first-guess.
  • These two teams are back at it tomorrow night as Oliver Perez takes on Andrew Miller. Last night's swag contest results are up and they aren't pretty. At your request I will try to post tomorrow's form earlier in the day so you can fill it out without waiting until right before gametime. As always, the latest game form can be found here (also linked on the left sidebar under "AA SWAG CONTEST").

0 recs | Comment 19 comments

Read Related

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

The Met game from the point of view of a air traveller...

Checked on the game while on the bus to DIA via Yahoo! Go. 2-0 Marlins?! Shoot! Pedro, come on, buddy.

Checked on the bus an hour later (it's the SkyRide, it takes a while). 4-0! Another 2 run inning! I wonder what's happening, but Pedro not looking good. Prolly some 2-run homers. (I would be half right)

Checked at DIA. 4-3! YES YES YES! Mets showing some comeback!

Last check at the gate before boarding. 4-4!!!! AWESOME! The kind of moxie we didn't show often last year!

(The 2 hour flight I wait in anticipation...I want 2-0!)

5-4 - DOH!!!!!!

Just saw the highlights. Sucks about Pedro. This talk about signing Vargas. Dear god.

David Wright MVP Watch: .000/0/0!

by ZaBlanc on Apr 2, 2008 3:10 AM EDT   0 recs

What now?

Pedro really worked hard to have a chance of returning to form (at least, partially), and it's a shame that he got hurt. I empathize with him.

Now - what do the Mets do? I have an idea. Get Heilman stretched out and give him a shot at being an SP.

I realize that this would hurt the bullpen, but you have to look at what options the Mets have available. Their best option for a replacement SP right now is Nelson Figueroa. Plan A, then, would be:
* Replace Pedro with Nelson Figueroa.
* Hope that Orlando Hernandez is able to recover soon, and can replace Figueroa in a couple of weeks
* Hope that Pedro gets better in a couple of months and can replace either Pelfrey or Hernandez.

Plan B - my plan - would be:
* Get Heilman stretched out as quickly as possible. While this is in progress, let Heilman and Sosa share starts.
* Replace Pedro's roster spot with Ivan Maldonado, who will go to the bullpen.
* Maldonado would NOT be the set-up man for Wagner, like Heilman was. That duty would be shared by a combination of Feliciano and a Smith/Schoenweiss platoon.
* When Heilman gets back to SP form, Sosa will be back in the bullpen mix.

My plan is not a great plan, but I think that it is the best option. For my plan to work, Heilman would have to be effective as an SP, and Maldonado would have to be serviceable in the pen. For plan A to work, Nelson Figueroa would have to be a serviceable SP for a while, and in the long run, Orlando Hernandez would have to recover and return to form. I don't see a great deal of upside to this plan. Expecting Hernandez - a man who is trying to reinvent himself as a pitcher at age 40-something, and who has not been able to throw pitch faster than 82mph this season - is wildly optimistic. Expecting Nelson Figueroa, who was released by the Pittsburgh Pirates and was most recently pitching in the Chinese Professional Baseball League, to have suddenly figured things out at age 34, is wildly optimistic.

Expecting Heilman to succeed as an SP is also optimistic - but I think that there's a more realistic chance that it could happen. Also, the Heilman plan has far more upside. If Heilman DOES become a good SP, then the Mets will be helped immediately, and in the future (if they sign him, which will be more likely if they give Heilman the SP shot that he wants).

by elliot on Apr 2, 2008 8:25 AM EDT   0 recs

agreed

I also prefer Plan B. Giving Heilman a shot at starting is like the Amazin' Avenue pet answer, though -- it keeps coming up for another round. The organization pretty clearly is not going to do it, so we may have to content ourselves with a lot of Duque/Pelfrey/Figueroa/whoever in the rotation for now.

by anonymous on Apr 2, 2008 9:43 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Heilman

You've got to leave Heilman in the pen. He's looked nasty so far this year, but he needs to stay put. I would rather sign a guy like Vargas, then take Aaron out of the pen.

It's time someone put their foot down... and that foot is me.

by sireric on Apr 2, 2008 9:32 AM EDT   0 recs

Why?

Why does Heilman need to stay put?

by JoshNY on Apr 2, 2008 9:34 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Because that's what the Mets have decided

Just think how different Heilman's career could have been if Brian Bannister hadn't had such a great spring in 2005.

by ams258 on Apr 2, 2008 10:00 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Heilman needs to stay put

If you move him it weakens the pen big time. If Sanchez was healthy and back to his old form, I might agree, But looking at the pen right now, you've got a couple of OOGY's (Show, and Pedro 2) Wise, Sosa, and then what? Heilman is is the best SU guy we've got. Unless he can be adequately replaced I don't think you can move him.

It's time someone put their foot down... and that foot is me.

by sireric on Apr 2, 2008 11:37 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

hey how bout chan ho park!

I hear brian lawrence is available!!!

god effing damn it.

by kendynamo on Apr 2, 2008 10:01 AM EDT   0 recs

also

nice return of the pics. they add a subtle level of catharsis when reading each recap.

by kendynamo on Apr 2, 2008 10:02 AM EDT   0 recs

achilles' heel

It's already clear that if the Mets have a major, glaring problem this year it is the surprising shallowness of the roster. Depth hasn't been a problem in the past few years, with Omar making smart low-cost pickups like Jose Valentin, Duaner Sanchez, etc. and building a lot of choices into the bench and bullpen. But this offseason was markedly quiet on this front, with few cheap signings (useful players like Sean Casey and more recently Reed Johnson signed ultra-cheap one-year deals elsewhere) and we saw some dumb flexibility-limiting moves like Castillo's long-term deal. The injuries to older players, predictable if still sad, should've been anticipated with some more insurance in the form of average or better talent on the bench, and it hasn't been, at least not adequately. The top-heavy talent of the best few players on this team will not be enough to carry it to the playoffs without more insurance at the bottom of the roster.

by anonymous on Apr 2, 2008 11:29 AM EDT   0 recs

Pitching

At this point, the Mets have no idea what they'll get from Pedro or Duque. Even if Pedro's injury isn't super serious, you don't know how a hammy will respond (see Bannister, Brian).

The bullpen looks solid, imo, so I don't think they should mess with it. The easiest thing to do would be to sign Claudio Vargas or Jeff Weaver (preferably Vargas). The guys we have in the minors would have been ok for a 5th/spot starting position, but if Duque and Pedro can't answer the bell, we need someone who can give us innings.

Vargas' peripherals aren't terrible and in fact, they suggest he should be seeing more success than he has been. He would benefit from pitching at Shea in front of our defense.

by SQUAD on Apr 2, 2008 12:04 PM EDT   0 recs

Don't overuse the bullpen

The bullpendoes look OK. If there were a better option than, say, Vargas or Weaver for a #5 pitcher, I'd love to leave the bullpen alone. If you sign Vargas, though, and leave Heilman in the bullpen, and if Vargas has a hard time consistently going more than five innings, it will stretch the bullpen thin, and weaken it, even while leaving the personnel where they are. If Heilman is a good SP who can go 6 or 7 innings, then that would help the bullpen. I just think that Ivan Maldonado (the guy that they can use to replace Heilman) is a better reliever than Claudio Vargas is a starting pitcher.

by elliot on Apr 2, 2008 2:06 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I'd be more worried about ruining Heilman

Whenever I hear this idea, all I can think of is how unsuccessful Ryan Madsen was when the Phillies tried this. Madsen and Heilman are very similar, they have the same pitches, and their deliveries are even close. Madsen was terrible as a starter and it even took him a while to become a competent reliever again. I know that they are to different guys and you can't project how good Heilman will do based on how Madsen did, I just can't remember the last time a pitcher who was a solid reliever for a few years made a successful transition into a starter. Terry Adams is another example.

It's time someone put their foot down... and that foot is me.

by sireric on Apr 2, 2008 3:09 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I would assume

that most relievers became relievers because they weren't successful starters. Heilman became a reliever because the Mets had a number of successful starting pitchers in 2005, and there was no room for him. So the normal trend of relievers failing as starters may not apply to him.

But this is a silly argument. No matter how badly I wish they would, the Mets are not going to start Heilman.

by ams258 on Apr 2, 2008 3:40 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Heilman's chance to start has passed...

Elliot, believe me, I was the biggest proponent of Heilman becoming a starter back in '06 and even in ST '07. But this team has been constructed with him as the setup man to Wagner. I agree with the poster above, he is the only pitcher in the pen other than Wagner (and MAYBE Feliciano) who can consistently get both RH and LH hitters out.

As for Maldonado, he wasn't even in contention, if I recall correctly, for a BP slot. Both Register and Stokes were being considered before him. Why do you think he would be so great?

Vargas fits the profile of a pitcher Peterson has had success with. Flyball pitcher who has solid stuff and strikes a good amount of people out. I think Vargas, under the tutelage of Peterson and with the help of Shea, would be a nice back end pitcher.

Last thing on Heilman. I just don't think it's prudent to weaken a strength, which would result in both the rotation and bullpen becoming weaker. By going with Figueroa, Vargas, Armas, or even a young kid like NIese or Parnell in the rotation, at least you're keeping the bullpen in tact.

by SQUAD on Apr 2, 2008 3:43 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Maldonado doesn't suck more than Vargas doesn't suck

It's not that I think Maldonado will do all that great - I just think that he'll do a better job than Vargas. Maldonado has better peripherals. Over the last two years as a starter, Vargas had WHIPs of 1.41 and 1.54. He averaged under 6 innings per start. Vargas is 30, and I don't see much chance of him improving. Maldonado is not great - granted. But Vargas scares me more.

Also - I'm not locked in to Maldonado. If you have a better right-handed relief pitcher in mind, great. I just used Maldonado as an illustration, because he seemed potentially serviceable in a low-impact bullpen spot.

by elliot on Apr 3, 2008 8:45 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

speaking of Brian Bannister

Anyone see what he did today against Detroit's ridiculous lineup? 7IP, 2H, 0R, 0BB. It's enough to make me want to do exactly like the photo above.

I was a fan of the trade at the time, and I still don't think Bannister will ever amount to more than a back-of-the-rotation guy, but man, could the Mets use him right now.

Flushing, Queens: soon to be known as Johan's-burg!!!

by Greenpoint Ian on Apr 2, 2008 3:38 PM EDT   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Your #1 home for lethargic New York ballplayer discourse.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recent FanPosts

3387_small
Castillo Wants the Job
Sbnlogo_small
Big MLB.com Sale - 11/19 only
Small
N.L. MVP Voting is a Joke
Ian_face_small
Fire Joe Morgan calls it quits
Img_1435_small
K-Rod's Value
O-brother-where-art-thou-4_small
What the hell Peavy?
O-brother-where-art-thou-4_small
"And the crap talking continues between the METS and the phillies, ala Jimmy Rollins"
Small
Fernando Tatis Re-signed
3387_small
Polar-Opposite Offseasons
C1fc33125ca7_small
Met's Top 20 Prospects

Post_icon New FanPost All FanPosts Carrot-mini

FanShots

Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.

Recent FanShots

Mets in Pursuit of J.J. Putz for '09 Closer
Citi shares reverse course, sale talk optimism fades
Utley to have hip surgery; possibly out until June
New York Mets pitcher Aaron Heilman wants to get out of bullpen
"And let's see what happens when the person pitching starts off the inning.  And... THAT happened. Apparently it was an "S," according to the board..."
All I Want for the Holidays is…
Report: Met's Sign K-Rod
Trevor Hoffman done in San Diego as Padres pull offer
If I were the Commissioner of Baseball
Shea Stadium Dismantlement

Post_icon New FanShot All FanShots Carrot-mini


Managers

Aa_avatar_small Eric Simon

ad

Site Meter