TEA LEAVES

Posted December 29, 2012

CAN you read a map?

If you can then you can probably read the EAGLES Front Office pretty well. Look at what they do and what they set up, not at how you feel. Look at what you AREN'T hearing as well.

First the moves:

DT Antonio Dixon was brought back on a TWO YEAR deal. Why? They already know what he brings to the table, so they must want to bring him back to do something he's good at.  Why bring him into a crowded DT rotation when you already have a guy on your Practice Squad? Then EAGLES mouthpiece Dave Spadaro takes the time (with just one game left this season) to sell us Dixon for "the future". WTF?? The future? How do you know? The new HC hasn't even signed let alone brought in a DC yet.  Systems need players that fit, we all know that. Unless they already know what they're running, how do they know that Dixon fits that system? Who knows what system the next DC may want to run? 

On the EAGLES site is a "Who Returns" video. I haven't watched it, but its presence speaks volumes. If we're getting a new coach, why should they already be publicly debating which players to part with before he gets here? And since when did THIS organization publicly discuss cuts that BEFORE they'd already made up their mind? Especially if they turned out to be players that a new coach may want, or need, or feels he can coach up? 

From every source I've read the odds on favorite for fans and the media to come here is Chip Kelly. But those same sources say he'll also want player/personnel control. If the EAGLES do this and undercut him before he even interviews, it goes a looooong way to souring him on us (See: Spagnuolo).

And here's what you haven't heard. Reporters have made no mention of Andy Reid or his staffers moving out more boxes than usual from his office. (This is the part where you say the local media wouldn't be watching for such a thing.) This team has given none of the traditional "beheading of the king" signs that you look for prior to a canning. No one has thrown him under a bus. Team discipline as far as showing up to meetings, practices, etc. hasn't wavered. Sideline spats with players (since the one in the preseason with Cullen Jenkins) number zero, which should have only increased with blood in the water. But again, zero.

At this point it's all reading tea leaves. Even for the guys with access. We'll know something in a few days. But don't be stunned or overly pissed if Lurie stands pat. There are enough indications that he may do just that.

35 Comments:
  • I will be surprised if Lurie keeps Reid but I won't be overly pissed. I don't think he will be coach next year but if he is I will hope he finally is holding what he and Lurie have always wanted to be holding at the end of the year...the Lombardi. Don't think it will happen but just like I always type...nothing more we as fans can do except hope!
  • [not displayed: comment from locked account]
  • This was from Geoff Mosher of CSNPhilly.com dated August 30th, 2012. There is a video that goes with it if you want to check it out. Lurie is aked if 8-8 would be enough to save Reid's job (nothing about an extension) and he plainly states...No, it would not":


    Eagles chairman Jeffrey Lurie issued an ultimatum Thursday to his head coach: Another 8-8 season won’t cut it.

    Lurie, holding his annual state-of-the-franchise press conference before kickoff of the Eagles-Jets preseason game, said he expected to see “substantial improvement” this season and suggested that Reid wouldn’t see the final year of his contract if the Eagles disappointed.

    After saying that he doesn’t “have a level or anything like that” to determine whether Reid returns in 2013 for his final year, Lurie was asked if another 8-8 season could save Reid’s job.

    “No, it would not,” he said.

    Asked later to clarify that remark, given that injuries and other factors could threaten the success of any single season, Lurie backpedaled just slightly on his decree.

    “Listen, you’ve just got to make the best decisions you can after the season,” he said. “But as I said, 8-8 was unacceptable.”

    Pressed once more on the topic, Lurie again spoke directly.

    “Again, I’m not going to make blanket statements, but I really wanted to try to explain to you that 8-8 was unacceptable,” he said. “I guess if two-thirds of the team is not playing, there’s always exceptions. But that was a really unacceptable outcome. I just really wanted to reiterate that.”
  • [not displayed: comment from locked account]
  • It isn't wrong and you should have no problem finding the video. The post, except for my introduction, was copied and pasted and when I copy and paste I change nothing. That wouldn't be very honest. Of course all things will be factored in and I already typed that Lurie has every right to change his mind regarding his football team if he chooses to.
  • Reid and Vick are gone. I did watch their stay or go report. Basically they sent Nnamdi, Cullen Jenkins, and Mike Vick packing. To be honest I doubt I will be as shocked if Reid stays then some people will be when he leaves. The reality is why would any fan want Reid to come back? Are fans happy with no winning seasons in two years? Are they happy with no playoff victories since 08? If you want Reid back then you don't want the Eagles to improve. Reid in lame duck status would only make next season even worse and make Lurie lose all credibility. By week 3 fans would be putting their tickets on Stub hub for 10 bucks and still have trouble selling them. Bringing back Reid isn't the move of the self proclaimed Gold Standard, rather it would be a move that cowards and lazy organizations make.
  • Asomugha and Vick both leaving will create a lot of dead money that will count against the cap. I wouldn't doubt that the Eagles ask Asomugha to restructure his contract...and possibly cut him the following year if he doesn't pick his game up under new coaches (maybe they take his money and resign the younger Rodgers-Cromartie..can they afford to let both walk?). I agree with your outlook on how it will go and how it will probably be if Reid stays. Even if next years Eagles were 3-1 (where they were this year) fans will still be waiting for the bottom to drop out. Lurie has already said that the reason he puts the fans and media on notice that he will not fire his coaches during the season is because he doesn't want the media circus breaking out...if he goes into next year with Reid in his last year of a contract and the Eagles start struggling right off the bat (a very strong possibilty with no sure fire franchise quarterback in the wings) the media circus will start extremely early. Lurie doesn't need that coming off these last two years. Lurie gets a bye with a new head coach and a young quarterback...he gets crucified holding onto Reid for that one last year if Reid doesn't bounce back.


    No problem Spotella! Lurie could change his mind obviously or decide that the injuries were bad enough or simply that he doesn't want to pay another coach while owing Reid 6 million. His team, his perogative. We shall see soon!
  • Nnamdi is only owed 4 mil against the cap and if the Eagles part ways with Vick soon after the SB non of his money will count against the cap. The guaranteed money is what matters. Now their cap numbers are high if the Eagles keep them and do nothing, but we both know that wont happen.

    What's funny to me is all of the Doomsday Prophisiers of what will happen once Reid is gone. These predictions of "lean years to come" in the near future. Have these folks been watching? The lean years are already here! No playoff game in 2 seasons. No playoff victory in 4 seasons. No Super Bowl appearance in 8 seasons! These people need to get a clue.
  • According to eaglescap.com the Eagles will be hit with over 7 million dead money for Vick (his left over signing bonus that was pro-rated gets lumped together in one year). They won't owe him the money but it will count against the cap. That's over 11 million between he and Asomugha alone...quite a bit of money. Who knows what will happen but for what they have brought to the Eagles the last two years I won't miss either of them too much.

    So the Doomsdayers choice would be to go into his last year fully knowing that the chances are still great that Lurie will still have to hire a new coach next year? Or maybe just give Reid an extension now fully based on his first 10 years and not his last 3? Yeah, that would be a great idea!
  • 7 mil of dead cap money. That's interesting, because the guys on the Eagles stay or go made it seem as if Vicks money only become guaranteed if he stays. Still 7 dead is a lot less than the money owed for next season. Yeah people wanting the coach back for not one, but 2 lame duck seasons is stupid. To give Reid an extension would be the dumbest thing the Eagles did since hiring an O-line coach to be a defensive coordinator. The Eagles would be the laughing stock of the league. Injuries as an excuse? Naw injuries had nothing to do with the 8-8 from last season. No major injuries to the defense until last week so what's that excuse? Even when the offense was healthy they averaged 16 points a game. How some people just ooze over mediocrity.
  • I think you are stretching this Reid is good with quarterbacks thing a bit far. I don't even think the is a 5% chance Reid is back. The is no legit reason to bring him back. Lets be frank. 80% of the customers don't want him back. The product has rapidly degraded over the past two seasons. Redistributing the same garbage will only add to further degrading. Reid has disobeyed orders by going back to the same old tired comments like "do a better job" and so on. Not only that ,but Reid's own agent used his personal tragedy as a negotiation tactic to get Lurie to resign him. How cold is that? Lurie has let go of his wife and his best friend this season. Roseman is looking to make a power play. Roseman and Lure seem to be pretty close. There is no reason to think Reid will be back. It's bad for business, it's bad for the Eagles, and its bad for Roseman. Tell me how can a team that is so clearly lacking in accountability bring back a coach that is the reason for the lack of accountability and not hold that coach accountable for the past two seasons?
  • More embarrassing than Lurie having to endure another losing season, would be to watch his former coach get his new team to the playoffs, while still footing him another 6 million to do nothing for you. That's equivalent to paying to get your ex's hair done, so she can look good for her new boyfriend. It's what we used to call getting chumped. Losing is one thing, getting chumped is another.

    Why would Lurie want to end up like the fans who pay $60 for tickets, and then hold up signs that say "FIRE ANDY!"?
  • It could happen...and the Eagles could just chug along with Reid for another 14 years and never win a championship. After years of almosts and kind of close and two straight years of not even in the ballpark and getting further away even the most loyal of owners has to say enough is enough and take their chances. If Reid gets to the playoffs next year with his new team than Lurie (and we as fans) just needs to realize that it doesn't necessarily mean it would have happened if he stayed with the Eagles. I think Lurie is smart enough to realize that. I stated it before, sometimes change is good for everyone involved.
  • The entire statement was economics based. At no point did I say that Reid WOULD get his next team to the playoffs, what I DID say was it would be embarrassing for Lurie to pay him 6 million dollars of his money for no reason, while he did it.

    As I said even guys who get paid and granted access to do this, are all over the map about whether Reid's firing is 100% likely or only 5% likely. Fans on the other hand want to talk about it like it's already been done, without respect to or recognition of the many moving parts that go into this decision, not the least of which are basic economics or the friendship between these two men.

    Fans mostly don't like either man, so to them this is easy. A no-brainer even. But owing a guy you fired 6 mil for no reason, when his team was still packing a stadium in bad weather, is not something that even sounds like it should be easy to do. But some fans don't want to hear any of this and will argue the validity and reality of these points when folks such as myself or 20Dawk brings them up.

    Fans here HATE the way Lurie runs the team. They HATED the way Banner managed it. They HATE the way Reid coaches it. Yet when the team makes a move that goes against how fans feel, the fans act exasperated. EVERY TIME! On one hand it's sad and on the other hand it's downright hilarious.

    Today many continue to ignore that this may be another one of those times when the EAGLES organization does something more in accordance with their desire of being a successful business than with the fanbase's wishes, which change from year to year. (Ricky Williams, WR, Fire Andy, Fire Marty, McNabb gone, LB, Jeff Garcia, McNabb Back, Fire Andy, McNabb gone, Kevin Kolb, Michael Vick named starter, Fire Andy, Fire Juan, Release Vick, Release Nnamdi, Fire Andy...)

    In the time since Reid has been here, this team has gone from being a sad sack franchise to one of the leagues more successful franchises. I'm talking as a business model, not as mostly meaningless wins and losses. Amid the clamoring for Reid's head the national media never seems to stop repeating this point or how good a coach Reid happens to be.

    While I'm sure that means absolutely nothing to you and your ilk, it may, just may, mean a little something to the only person who's opinion matters at all in any of this.
  • Me or my ilk, flip? Funny, coming from the man who stood side by side (figuratively obviously) with hollywoodeagle (you remember him right...the man you now have blocked) typing like he was the only one that made sense all because Lurie and Reid traded one of your favorite players. It's a freaking part of football. Good coaches get fired and old quarterbacks get let go when results aren't met and fans discuss it. I have constantly discussed how Lurie and Reid have been the best owner and coach in franchise history but after 14 years and no championship something has to change. I have typed that Lurie could decide that he doesn't want to pay Reid and another coach and I absolutely meant it when I stated that if Reid is back as Eagles coach I will root him on. Right now, Reid possibly being fired is the biggest story regarding the Eagles and if I feel like discussing it and what that could mean to the Eagles future than that is what I will do. You may find it disrespectful after 14 years and no championship, I call it news and a strong possibilty.
  • Of course it's a possibility, and of course you'll root for Reid next year if he's still here. I already knew that. Otherwise you'd have to stop being an EAGLES fan.

    As for Hollywood, at a point in time we did agree on the idea of being heard via economics; but while I still root and expect big things (while others may not), he spews nothing but hatred for the entire organization. To say you love something and spend all your time savaging it, is to not be possessed of a balanced mind. It is illogical, unreasonable, and possibly even insane. Since I value my sanity, I leave him to others.

    I block him (and some others) now because I come on here to discuss football and cheer with other fans, not to trade personal insults with people I don't even know. The only thing he offers is vitriol and psychic drainage, and my day was always worse for having read him. After having blocked him however, my visits here are far more pleasant now. These days even when there is discord (as there is now between you and I) it is football centered. I'm at peace with this.

    Peace is grand.


  • Hollywood is a subject we definitely agree on. You choose to ignore him...I choose to show him and anyone that wants to read our "discussions" how wrong he is. Look, flip, you seem to get offended by the public outlook on current sports news when it is something negative about someone you respect, I look at it for what it is. I appreciate what Reid brought to the Eagles organization but that won't stop me from discussing it when I choose to. When the Eagles season isn't falling apart around us, I try to stay positive. You brought up how everyone was down during the early 2-1 start...it was because of how it happened. It wasn't a team that looked crisp in the preseason...it was a team that looked clueless. That got to 2-1 by barely beating a team that just about everyone thought the Eagles would crush in the Browns and turned the ball over at an alarming rate getting there...this all after an 8-8 season where they had to win 4 almost meaningless games at the end of the season just to get there. This team hasn't wowed anyone in quite a long time and fans are upset and are going to discuss this...it happens everywhere.
  • To be clear, I don't get offended. I recognize that each will do as is in his nature. I voice my opinion simply to show that we aren't all negative people. Some of us are happy, positive creatures, who don't think someone should have to be fired or humiliated just because a they don't always win.

    What this team brings to this city is all too often overlooked, because it hasn't brought in a trophy. I remember when this team wasn't so good. When there were fewer vendors, fewer tourist dollars, no free vision screening truck(Jermane Mayberry), or houses bought for single moms (Asante Samuels). That sold out stadium especially in a poor economy, is the lifeblood of some of my friends, and another Ray Rhodes type era will literally affect how well they eat and if they can afford to send their kids to good schools. So yes, the instability makes me nervous.

    You know the expression, "Evil wins when good men stand by and do nothing" ? I put this out there because if I don't, who will? There is far more at stake (at least for me and mine) than a trophy. I have trophies. My kids have trophies. Both my lady and I just won our respective fantasy league championships (I repeated!). It's bragging rights, but trophies mean nothing the year after you get them. We say as much to Cowboy fans clinging to the 1990's.

    This team has made positive impacts on peoples actual lives and it's just sad that the only thing that means anything to many Philadelphians is an inert hunk of metal.
  • Sure, trophies mean nothing the year after but almost every fan's desire in every city is to want to see the team they root for passing the Lombardi around. Lurie, wants it, Reid wants it and every player that is on that team at the end of the year are hoping to share in that glory and almost everyone of us want to watch them celebrating and enjoy as much of that feeling that we can as fans on that day and for quite a while after. You have other reasons that you want the safety of having a coach in Philly you are comfortable with and feel will get you some good to great seasons and I can understand that and I am sure that Lurie feels the same way to an extent. He also constantly tells the media and fans his main goal is a Super Bowl and that it has always been and he should understand when fans question bad moves and call out for change when the team seems stagnant.
  • Our Phillies won a trophy in 2008 and now the fans talk and behave as if that were decades ago. There is a trophy, but the hole is still not filled.

    I think a trophy would be nice, but when I want the feel of winning something, I just go out and win something. If you truly desire glory, go get your own glory. This sense of entitled vicariousness is just plain creepy and more than a little sad.

    Better to watch the games purely for the entertainment. While a trophy might be nice to see, there is no sense in allowing the wait to break your heart every year.

    Find something that will make you happy. Fill your own hole as opposed to constantly lamenting a thing you have no control over. This needless suffering is like being upset that every year evolution doesn't bring you the wings or the tail you've wished for, when it has never done this thing before.

    I understand that you will undoubtedly do as you wish, as we all achieve our own enlightenment in our own time and at our own choosing, but I will choose to enjoy my legs, as opposed to lamenting my lack of wings.
  • Andy Reid getting another team to the playoffs wouldn't be embarrassing at all. In fact all it would do is confirm the fact a change was needed. Who is to say the next coach wont get the Eagles to the playoffs? To keep a coach, because you SCARED he's going to get another team to the playoffs is not only it's a poor way to run a business, it's also plain stupid. If Lurie does it then I hope he does sell the team, because we will never win with a coward as an owner. With that being the case I don't believe Lurie is the coward people foolishly want him to be.
  • [not displayed: comment from locked account]
  • Flip, addressing your latest comment down here because yardbarker doesn't want us to type too much right now and won't allow me to reply to my own comment.


    You take this way too far! Where do I ever state that I am entitled to a trophy? All I state is that I would LIKE to see the Eagles make a certain move just like you do on occasion. The only difference is that you happen to disagree with my stance on this one! Creepy and sad that we come to a football forum and discuss that we would like to see the team we root for win a championship and ways we think they can accomplish that? Really, flip? You do get that just because people want to see their team win a championship and are a bit bummed at the end of the year if they don't it probably doesn't take hold of their lives, don't you? I know it doesn't take control of mine. All we are doing is discussing our desires FOR "OUR" TEAM...I have stated numerous times the only thing we as fans can do is hope our teams make the right moves. Hope is all I have when it comes to FOOTBALL. I lose no sleep over it, I don't obsess over it...I enjoy it and get a bit bummed when they lose. It isn't even close to being the big deal you make it seem like when it comes to me. Sure doesn't seem the city of Philadelphia loses a step in the Eagles down years so I would guess the city of Philly continues on living too. It's football and we are on a football forum...what the hell do you expect?
  • I didn't say you thought you were entitled to a trophy, but the fanbase seems to think that they are, when nothing could be further from the truth. No one is entitled to enjoy another one's glory. If you will not hold one in your arms when they are fallen, you do not deserve to share in their exaltation.

    You seem eager to be offended and fight with me as the tone of your comments and responses towards me have been unnecessarily hostile as of recent. I am not going to fight with you, or engage in petty name calling. I do not come here to do this thing. There are plenty on here who deal in exactly this, so you will have to satisfy your desire for childish bickering with one of these who do this thing.

  • So some of the fans that buy Eagles season tickets, jerseys and merchandise and watch every single game don't deserve to share in the Eagles joy just because they may have wanted to see the Eagles go in a different direction? Can't disagree with you more, flip. I'm never eager to be offended and rather not fight with you but it's hard not to be offended by your holier than thou attitude because you have chosen to look at the Eagles poor season with your rose color glasses this year and question the integrity of pretty much everyone who would like to see the Eagles bring in a new head coach. You state that you aren't directing your comments at me but I take it that way when you are discussing the issue with me, you know my stance and come on flip...you ended one of your preachings with me and my ilk...yeah, not directed at me. I have constantly stated I like Reid, think he is a good man but I simply think it's time for him to go. If all you want to see is "I think it's time for him to go" then you simply don't know me or my ilk!
  • You are correct to say that I don't know you, and I have said as much directly to you. This is why I see no point in fighting with you.

    Allow me to clarify, as I thought I had done before, by your ilk, I simply meant those members of the fanbase who write as you do. The word ilk is no insult in itself. In fact I thought it sounded gentler than to say something like "you and your kind", as that statement almost sounds racist to me.

    As for my holier than thou attitude and my preaching, I said I was turning over a new leaf. I meant it when I said I was in a wonderful place in my life. I am trying to reflect the positive energy that surrounds me, onto all who venture near me. I am not perfect at it, but I am striving.
  • I'm not looking to argue and I don't come on here to whine about the Eagles either but if I choose to discuss what is the hot topic surrounding the Eagles I will do that. I also have a hard time sitting back and typing nothing while reading comments directed at people that share my stance making us seem like dirt just because we feel a certain way about an issue (whether it is meant to or not).
  • And you should discuss the hot topic. You should even bring up things the rest of us have not thought of. This is why we all come here. To speculate and to discuss. If football outweighed bickering there would be so much more or us to do this thing.
  • What I don't get is how some one can claim not to care if the Eagles win a Super Bowl, but are completely afraid to get a new coach! The playoffs are no more of an "entitlement" than the Super Bowl is. So if you don't care if the team wins the Super Bowl, then you also shouldn't care if they make the playoffs or even who is the person leading them. More of the same hypocritical talk that goes on around here. People acting as if they are better when in reality they are no different at all. I can recall an entire article dedicated to ripping me by a certain person named "And The Horse You Rode On." I can recall that same person spending at least an hour posting the same thread to block anyone else from making a thread, because he decided to throw a tantrum. I've been around here a long time. What I've seen is certain people like to start problems and then act as if they are innocent later. Take Romorules. You and I both have had run ins with the guy. At the same time I admit I have done things in the past to provoke him and vice versa. But I am not going to sit here and act like I'm better than that if I'm creating threads trashing Dallas, the Cowboys, and their fans like some people are hypocritically doing on a regular basis. I'm probably going to get blocked by this hypocrite for calling him exactly what he is now, but that's not going to stop me from telling the truth.
  • He will type to you that it is different because it is "OUR" team but honestly, Eazy, great point. I guess it's okay to trash talk and act brash because that's what rival fans do but he will question the integrity of his own own city's fans just because they want to see change. He tries to act like he is a better person because he is at peace with his team. He will probably block us (he's already telling me he doesn't need my anger) and let him if he'd rather only discuss issues with people that agree with him and don't get annoyed when he takes that holier than thou approach. I forgot his tantrum that night...and here he has been preaching how we should act as fans. I guess he's grown since then. LOL.
  • Calling for boycotts and throwing tantrums, but now having little patience for fans who may do the same does not show he has grown at all. It only shows his true arrogance and hypocrisy. It also shows his childishness. To talk tash about Hollywood, but not having the balls to stand up to him and let him defend himself or even attack back shows his cowardice. He can come up with all his b.s. reasons as to why he blocked people, but he can not hide from what he's already done. When the going gets tough, the hypocrite gets going. Like Lauryn Hill said in lost ones:

    Hypocrites alway want to play innocent.
    Always want to take it to the full out extent.
    Always want to make it seem like good intent.
    Never want to face it when it's time for punishment....

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