The Eagles Should Not Let Foles Go For Anything Less Than A 2nd.

Posted February 21, 2013
Birdflipper brought up the fact about Nick Foles being sacked 20 times in 6 starts. Okay so why was that? It was because his line consisted of 4 castoff players, two of them probably shouldn't be in the NFL. He also didn't have McCoy, Celek, and Jackson for extended periods of time. Okay now lets look at Mike. Mike also lost several key lineman during the season; however all of those players were lost while he was under center. Other than Peters of course. That means he had better overall protection than Foles did. Nick Foles sack percentage was actually lower than Vick's! So with a better line, better skilled players, and a coach who was actually still trying to win football games, Mike Vick had a lower passer rating than Nick Foles and sacked at a higher rate than Nick Foles. So the LOGICAL thing for me to do is to wonder what can Foles do with a healthy line, a coach gameplanning for him, a healthy Set of skilled players, a preseason, and camp with him at the number one spot. That's not me hating on or hating Mike Mike. That's just the truth. If Mike Vick wants to search his inner self then he should go be a monk. Meanwhile he needs to produce on the field in order for his team to win games. Some food for thought. Mike Vick for his career averages LESS THAN 6 wins a season. If Vick does end up starting I suggest you all not expect too much from him other than a heavy dose of what he's already given us.
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  • i've been saying that vick isnt the answer since before kelly was hired. i will say the QB market sucks and idk if using the #4 on geno smith is smart so idk who SHOULD be our qb but it shouldnt be vick. as for foles going for a 2nd rounder i agree and we could probably get it. maybe we could turn that and a future first rounder into another first round pick this year to grab geno smith as well as another player with the #4 pick to help out the D
  • I don't get how anyone can vehemently defend Vick as if he's the answer to all of the problems. I will agree all of the problems are not his fault, but that doesn't mean ignore the ones he causes on his own. Mike is not the answer here. That isn't to say Nick Foles is, but I know it isn't Mike Vick. I wouldn't mind if they moved down in the draft, acquired more picks, and get Geno Smith too.
  • Im telling you getti ng rid of Vick and Foles might mean a whole new start. I agree with Flip when it comes to ripping that secondary apart. If they are going to tear down to rebuild they better remove Vick and Foles because without a defense it could be worse than last year. At least with geno they buy time to rebuild. But if Vick starts and cant protect leads again. Disaster.
  • Protect leads? The Eagles couldn't score points period!
  • I can recall two games last season where the team couldn't protect a lead. In both cases Vick and the offense had opportunities to make plays and they didn't. I don't blame it all on Vick, because some of those calls by the coaches were just awful, but Vick and the rest of that offense is paid to make plays. They didn't do it nearly enough. Let us all stop trying to make excuses for him. Mike Vick played poorly last season and the year prior. Ironically if you just look at his bare stats they put him right on par with his Atlanta stats. In other words Mike Vick is being Mike Vick.
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  • I get the Vick move if they truly are going to make him compete for the job. If they are just going to hand it to him then it makes no sense even as a stopgap player. Dixon would be a better stopgap than Vick. At least Dixon is going to play. Mike could be down by week two. It doesn't matter, because its is a MORTAL LOCK Mike Vick will get injured and the Eagles will be going to another option. It's not a matter of if, but when.
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  • Well Chip doesn't have our bias. He's never seen the guy play in live action.
  • First we will have to see what happens in round 1, so I don't think anyone should get too excited about a trade anytime soon. Atleast 3 qbs will go in the top 15, smith, Gibson, n most likely Barkley. They shouldn't but they will. Ur (not u but a ur in general) at the chiefs jags bills and a couple other teams who can n most likely will reach on a qb in the first. So our options for a trade will narrow after that. Add in teams that may think foles isnt that great ( weak arm bad feet etc) that could have just picked him up for a 3rd last year n the possible trades narrows even more. My guess is our best bet would be to send him the the jets for a 3rd. It isnt what we all want but this isnt madden the other teams do have their own gms who will say he's worth less n the two teams need to find a middle ground
  • That's why the Eagles don't necessarily have to trade him unless they get the deal they want. They are the team with the commodity. If they can drum up interest for him, then maybe they can get some teams in a bidding war. I just think its odd for a team that everyone says doesn't have a quarterback would simply give away to another team. It's not a logical move. I guess people are just assuming the Eagles want to run Chip Kelly's exact Oregon offense despite The fact Chip Kelly has said otherwise even citing his own time in New Hampshire and the fact he brought in an NFL coach as his OC in Shurmur.
  • If the Chiefs truly want him I think their 3rd round pick may be what happens. It isn't the second round pick that the Eagles say they want but the first pick in the 3rd round is getting close to the value they wanted, is a little higher than what the Eagles used on him last year and may be fair value for a guy that could be losing his spot because he simply doesn't fit their system. The Chiefs 3rd this year and maybe a conditional mid round pick next year...of course that is assuming that Kelly does not think he can run his offense.
  • So far Chip Kelly hasn't been as orthodox as people think he is. I'm going to take him at his word. I get coach speak. I know they tend to drop a lot of bull, but like you wrote before if Vick is his guy then why isn't he just backing him? If Foles isn't his guy why is he going out his way to praise him? If he thinks so highly of Foles then why in the world would he then go and trade him? So far both the Eagles and Chiefs have indicated that Foles isn't available. We'll see what happens, but from a common sense standpoint Chip Kelly would be completely contradicting himself and everything he has said and done if he trades Foles and keeps Vick.
  • Coach speak isn't a crime and every coach does it, Eazy. I do think that Foles would be available at the right price but that still doesn't mean just hand Vick the keys of the car. He crashed that car in 2011, backed it up between seasons, floored it and crashed it worse in 2012. I stated it earlier, I'm hoping for Manuel or Nassib...preferably Manuel and hopefully Kelly decides to work with him early. Makes more sense with a rebuild. That could change watching what Manuel does in the combine. He could struggle or he could light it up and his value could climb but if he is there and Kelly likes him, I would have no problem with them using their 2nd round pick on him or Nassib.
  • If that is the case then I could see Vick playing the Doug Peterson role as a place holder, but I could also see the same being done with Dixon. At least Dixon would be more familiar with the offense than Vick is.
  • the biggest reason i think foles is the odd man out is because of the system. if there truly is an open competition than its going to favour on qb over the other. if he goes more traditional nfl style, like shurmur would influence, than foles will have an advantage. if he goes more oregon style vicks the guy. add in the addition of dixon n it seems kelly wants to run a style closer to oregon than traditional nfl. so as of now i think we have to say adavntage vick.
  • Look Kelly hasn't walked into an ideal situation. he has no clear starting QB or at least not one anyone is putting much hope in, his defense is in shambles and he couldn't get any coaching hires that made anyone really get excited. Id respect the guy a lot more if he just came out and said this is my team now i'm gonna build it up the way i want it, it might take a season or two but we'll get there.
  • I think Kelly is just keeping his options open and he wants competition on his football team. I don't think any veteran on this roster can feel like they are safe especially if that veteran is making a lot of money. Competitions makes everyone better as a whole. Chip Kelly is looking at all of these guys with a clean slate. Anyone who comes into camp next season dogging it may find themselves off this team.
  • everyone should feel like their head is on the chopping block. no one has any history with kelly in the nfl and the nfl is a league of what have you done for me lately and lately no one has done anything for kelly. granted there are guys like lesean mccoy who are a safe lock just based on his talent and his body of work no one expect him to deliver anything short of what he has been delivering. guys like vick, watkins, allen, coleman, etc should all be taking this as a job interview. even trent cole, jason peters, and the "solid" guys on the team will still have to prove that they are still solid guys and deserve to be on the team esp with the rumors of the switching defensive schemes and a new offense.
  • I agree and other than Shady, Fletcher Cox, and Kendricks, many of the guys should fell like they are going to have to bust their tails. I think Jackson has been given some kind of talk about how he will be used in the offense so maybe he's a Chip Kelly guy in a way. All I know is a 4-12 team can't be too big on themselves. Chip Kelly is going to want to play fast. That doesn't necessarily mean he needs his quarterback to run fast, but he better be getting to that line, running plays, and quickly and decisively delivering that football to his playmakers.
  • the key to success for an eagles offense (which should continue even though kelly is now the head coach) is through the RB. for years when reid gave westbrook the ball the eagles won (also when we had a good defense). and the same was true when shady was given the ball 20+ times a game. if kelly is smart he'll continue with that.
  • I think that is something that has gotten lost in the Chip Kelly hiring. Chip will run the football. The run game is going to be a factor next season.
  • sorry idk why it posted my comment from the other thread here. but i'm glad kelly will run the ball its an aspect of the andy reid that drove me crazy for years
  • There is no such thing as rebuilds in the NFL. Its about money, fdrafts and free agents. The difference between a winner and a loser might be 2 key healthy veterans.
  • no the nfl is about building solid teams via free agency and the draft and then fielding the best team possible. generally after bad seasons teams take a look at what when wrong and then REBUILD to fix that problem. some rebuilds are minor like drafting a wr because you lost one others a bigger like when the Bengals lost carson palmer luckily they got andy dalton and aj green in the same year so it didnt take long. Miami is still looking for a franchise QB since Marino left. even other rebuilds are bigger like when an entire secondary that at one time boasted 2 of the best cbs in the league played horribly for two straight seasons.
  • I don't think two more free agents coupled with the current veterans suddenly make this team great or even a contender. The Eagles have tried to mask the fact they have drafted poorly the past few seasons with a bunch of mercenary free agents who were only out for a paycheck. The Eagles need to get back to drafting and developing their own young talent. They should avoid any free agent over 25 unless that guy has superior upside. They need to get back to the formula that made them good. Draft solid defensive players, solid offensive lineman, draft a franchise quarterback, and not necessarily in that order. I think Russell Wilson, RG3, Kapernick, and Luck have shown what a difference a great quarterback can make. Too bad more people can't see the truth.

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