Joe Horn: Pats Brady & Moss will always be called cheaters

joe horn is exactly right. i couldn't have said it any better. the first super bowl was tainted by the bullshit "tuck rule", and the next two were tainted b/c of "spygate''. i'm just glad someone had the balls to say this. i never had an opinion about joe horn, but now i can say he knows what he is talking about. and j00fek, don't talk about him never winning a super bowl b/c he was never on a good team. at least his teams didn't cheat.

can you show me the evidence?

do you really think the saints, who were terrible when he was there, and the falcons, who have won like 2 games, cheat?

not the teams that suck, cmon pay attention...
the evidence to what you stated, the 2 SB wins that the pats "cheated in"

YOU ALSO NEED THE START SHUTTING THE FRIG UP ABOUT OUR SUPER BOWLS AND CURRENT CHEATING THIS YEAR...WOULD LOVE TO RUN INTO YOU SOMEHOW AND "TALK"

sure..I don't doubt that a team can still suck even if they don't cheat... It is like cheating on a test and failing because you had the wrong answers. It happens dude. Penalties are a form of cheating..because they are not supposed to happen!! Sometimes the team that TRYS to cheat the most loses because of penalties!!!

correction..I meant teams CHEAT AND STILL SUCK..NOT DON'T SUCK. typo

haven't seen the evidence that barry bonds juiced, either.

and don't need to.

patriots*

didnt bonds just get indited for lying to a grand jury 19 times about knowingly using steroids?

no evidence there...

keep em comin'

Yeah......just like O.J. didn't kill his ex-wife. Everyone knows he did it. The Pats though got caught with clear-cut evidence turned into the league office. Is that good enough for ya?

nice picture...you should be talking about knitting...you must be a country club colts fan...asterisk?...whatever...it's amusing to me as, sure, Belichek did some things he never had to do...we would have won anyways...I'm the guy who makes sure our "crowd noise" CD doesn't skip...funny...haha...later BENJI, GET A MAN'S NAME

your are so sorry...tuck rule...don't even go there...I've seen some of your posts...your so anti NE, it's so obvious...cheat?...every team steals signals and films from seats, etc...we aren't doing any of that now son, are we...your goodell is watching us like a hawk...it's ironic how we never needed to "cheat" historically...your just bitter, say, Dallas fan? nothings tainted son...your team just doesn't have any trophies?...you never talk about your team...Joe Horn just knows that Dante is hooked up here now...you need to chill from your hatred towards us in NE...don't ever come here either...if you talk trash at any sport game in this town you will be pummelled...adios sucker

Can someone please send Joe Horn back to grammar school a la Billy Madison?

LOVE YOU...HE'S JEALOUS OF EX-TEAMMATE DANTE WHO MIGHT BE GETTING RING IN FEB...THANKS AND TC BAILEY, CAN'T STAND HIS COMMENTS OUT OF THE ARTICLES I'VE SEEN...HE IS SO IGNORANT

Joe Horn needs to be in a Super Bowl, he'd make the run up more interesting, ie cell phone at the goal post. I mean, the last thing the sports world needs is another Boston team winning a title.

Oh and yes, * for the tuck rule in 2001, and * for cheating. Patriots**

exactly, give them 2 **

BE A MAN AND RESPOND TO ME! I'VE BEEN DOGGING YOU MORE THAN ANYONE...TALK ABOUT YOUR TEAM...AND HOW WE WILL DESTROY THEM...IS IT THE STEELERS????? MAN, I HATE YOUR STYLE...NEGATIVE ALL THE WAY

TC - Pull your skirt up!! your panties are showing..

how about the fuck rule...fuck every other team as we march like Sherman in Atlanta fool!

It's not the Patriots fault the NFL had a dumbass rule. The play was stupid, but rules are rules and the Pats didn't make that rule. The refs made the call. The Pats did not cheat in that game.

For most of you and nation is true...but we like being hated...which is the main point to all this...we thrive on it in NWE...you couldn't hang here....would be goobled up son...GO CELTS TOO

arguing that the rings they won were helped by cheating is debateable. However, if they go on to win it this year I don't see how anyone can say they accomplished it because they cheated THIS year. They were caught after week 1 and punished. As for Joe Horn, he is fading as a player and isn't the same receiver he once was so he might as say something to get in the news cuz his play certaily isn't doing it.

The Patriots are being watched like a hawk each week by the NFL and there is no way they can possibly cheat so to me that makes this season all the more impressive. As far as putting the past superbowl victories with a * next to it, then you have to do it for every teams that were caught in any sports. This means cheating by anyone in a front office organization, coaching staff or player on the field.
If Patriots cheated by getting game film for future reference then I want every game that a player tested for steroids to be called cheaters.. Harrison got caught because he admitted to it but fair is fair, wipe it all out, wipe out the Chargers and all the other teams because without ONE play from one of these players then the outcome of the game could be different.
Let me give some examples of things I want changed if you want to continue to label the Patriots.
1- Dolphins (06') last season in their defeat, I want their games wiped out so they can be the first franchise to go undefeated and to lose every game in a single season because multiple players admitted to buying audio of the Patriots call at the line of scrimmage prior to the game so they knew what play was coming. After the Dolphins defeated the Patriots 21-0 in Miami last season, Dolphins linebacker Zach Thomas claimed he knew the Patriots' audibles. He wasn't kidding. Teams sometimes will place microphones on their defensive players to tape the opposing team's audibles. The team then matches the audibles with the play the offense runs. In the shutout loss to Miami, the Patriots played their worst game of the season, as Tom Brady was sacked four times. Coincidence?
2- Jets (07')this year because they were accused of simulating snap counts vs the ravens
3- Green Bay Packers (07'), "cheating" is debatable in this case but they are going against NFL Rules are are offering players incentives to make certain plays in game. This can be considered gambling too, Oh Boy! wipe out the records!!!!! I bet they don't go 9-1 without the Bribing, and I dare someone to prove 100% they would have, because there must be plenty of you out there because you can 100% prove against the Patriots.
4- Colts (07') In the Battle of Undefeated teams, Good -vs- Evil, the Colts were caught pumping in extra crowd noise when the Patriots were on offense.
5 - Vikings (98') They were accused by numerous teams for doing the same as the colts and pumping in crowd noise.
6- Bears (Ayanbedajo), Patriots (Harrison), Raiders (Cooper), Raiders/Broncos (Romanowski), Jaguars (Stroud), Chargers (Merriman), Browns (Tucker) and the list is way too long for all teams with players suspended for steroids...
7- Years ago, teams would flock to the San Francisco area for the East-West Shrine Game. Some coaches and scouts, however, would also take in a different site. They would go to the highest floor of a local hotel and, at the time unbeknown to the 49ers, would watch -- sometimes even film -- team practices
8 - Every Bears game coached under Lovie Smith and ALL Rams game when Lovie was Rams Def Coordinator, he hung himself on this one ""Stealing signals is an old art form,"
9 - Every home team should have to forfeit a game when their is communication issues when the away team has to ignore their headseats and go to hand signals (OH YEH THIS HAPPENED IN COLTS-PATS game too). There's no such thing as an innocent technical malfunction when the visiting team's headsets aren't working.
10- All teams who sign free agents from the team they are playing that week and release those players immediately afterwards.. This happens all the time in football and if the Jets happened to beat Pats in week 1 then they would have to forfeit that game since they signed WR- Reche Caldwell prior to the game and released him day after game.. The reasoning for this tactic? "One way that insight can be helpful is in the identifying of an opponent's calls at the line of scrimmage, from a first-hand source who played or coached for that team in the recent past.
"You try to get those false calls that teams like to use at the line,'' said one former player. "Player X or coach X who has been with that team might stop by the offensive or defensive meetings and say, 'Look for this if they say that. Or when the quarterback does this, look for that.' It can be very useful in some cases.''
11- Home teams often place video cameras on the sideline to record the opposing team's signals. The cameras are placed on the sideline under the guise that they provide extra game tape for the home team's coaches. When road teams attempt to get credentials for their sideline cameramen, the applications are usually rejected
12- 1995 Browns Playoff game, should be wiped out: When the Cleveland Browns played the New England Patriots in the 1995 AFC Wild Card round, Browns linebacker Carl Banks met an official before kickoff and told him he would jam Patriots tight end Ben Coates at the line of scrimmage. Coates spent most of the game screaming at the officials for the lack of holding calls. Banks, however, kept praising the officials while addressing the zebras by their first names. Asked about it 12 years later, Coates said: ''He got away with one--good for him. Linebackers are always trying to do that stuff.''
13. Most teams send a scout to watch the game of the next opponent. The scout sits in the press box and tries to pick up signals from the other team. The team being scouted, however, will often have a coach on the sideline wearing a headset that is not plugged in, and he gives bogus signals to throw off the scout, as well as the opposing team.
14- Okay, while we are at it, lets not never compare teams to the "good ol days" when football players played the games the right away, You know the 60s, 70s, 80s... In the 1960s and '70s, offensive linemen often put Vaseline on their jerseys so defensive linemen could not get a good grip. In the 1980s, the substance of choice was silicone.
Oh lets give another example of the good ol days:
Lester Hayes, a defensive back for the Raiders from 1977-1986, was infamous for putting Stickum on his hands so he could catch the ball more easily. "The sole focus of our team was to win consistently," said Hayes, who helped the Raiders win Super Bowls XV and XVIII. "Whether it was a mental or a physical advantage, we were going to do whatever was necessary to win. Our attitude was that if we could get away with something, we were going to do it."
THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE AMONG ALL THESE TEAMS ARE THE PATRIOTS ARE TRYING TO, IN THE WORDS OF BRADY, "KILL TEAMS": AND THE UNLIKE ANY TEAM IN NFL HISTORY, THERE IS NOTHING ANY TEAM CAN DO ABOUT IT!!!!!

they pats will always be known as cheaters dont matter if they go 19-0 or not this season is tainted

ignorant sap...we are watched like hawks by league...stang? sigh...we love being hated, but come up to NE and say that to any fan...you'll get badly "stanged"

stang as in mustang dumbass!! so im going to get mustanged???? what does that mean??? i was stating the facts you got cought cheating not just spy gate but harrison and his roids pats are cheaters

what little respect i had to tom brady and the pats are gone from this cheating and them running up the score

The reason the pats are running up the score is because of stupid comments like this. You really think the pats were the only ones that ever did something like this. The rest of the league disrespected the Patriots after mangini ratted on his former team and continue to do so. In return the patriots are going to kill and embarass every team they have a chance to, and to make everyone forget about spygate by showing how little it helped them if at all.

ditto!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i like it...adds more fuel to fire...like we need it

moss will always be called a cheter no doubt

you should have not even have gotten on article....your post is sorry...never heard of a wide receiver cheat...where is your evidence?

How come every single week on this site an article comes out and it starts a heated debate about the Patriots cheating or not? Regardless if they were caught cheating they are the best team in the league

thank god for you to counter that chump TCBAILEY...he is such a coward, he won't respond to my counterpoints...you are a scholar mon frere

Running up the-- should they just give the ball back to the other team every time they get it.?
The fault isn't the PATS running up the score the fault is the other team not stepping up to the plate and stopping them. This isn't high school level they are paid to play 4 quarters of football-- and play to winn. not play til we get a comfortable lead. The others teams have to be man enough to take the defeat no matter what the score.
Again there is no such thing as running up the score on this level of football.

Yeah there is, its called 58-3, 4th and 3 in the 4th Quarter, you go for it. Repeat, until time runs out.

I also find it very hard to believe that all you fans who pay 100s of dollars if not more to watch a football game, would rather go spend the money to watch your team sit in the ball for an entire half (this is what the Pats would have to do since they beat teams up so early) and not watch them setting records.. All these 1000s of fans at the game will be able to look back and say I was at the game the Patriots scored 50 points, etc... Sounds much more fun to talk about than I was there when we won 23-13 and sat on the ball for close to 30 minutes...
Jealousy is great and the league goes in cycles, look at how dominant the 49ers used to be and look at them now, as much as a Pats fan as I am, the time will come we need to rebuild and that's okay, but when the time comes for your team to be on top, remember how much hating you did when your team was on the bottom.

For the record, I think it should be noted that the perfect season is NOT actually 19-0....

The perfect season is going 19-0 and landing a top 3 pick in the following NFL Draft without giving up any additional picks!!!! Gotta love it..

When all said it and down the Pats moved down from the 28th pick last year (49ers got Joe Staley - a good player but not top 5 worthy!!) and got the 4th last year (DT- Kareem Brown) and a top 4-5 this year..

add the record, the draft picks and the envy from every other fan in the country.. thats a perfect season!

one more thing, tell me your favorite team and how long you been a fan, and I will guarantee I can find ways they had cheating accusations, players doing something illegal (Steroids, etc) or as some of you are complaining about the "tuck rule" in which the ref's made the call, and the right one according to league rules, I will find a play that had some controversy to it...

ALL TEAMS GO THROUGH IT, REAL FANS JUST DON'T COMPLAIN ABOUT IT

dbobola22: you make a whole lot of sense!

Also for the record folks the videotape of the Jets game nevermade it to the Pats. How could they have been cheating during that game? Just a thought.

when all is said and done (without having a draft pick) This year's PATS are going to be NEXT years PATS --something to think about.

Let's pretend for a minute you're favorite team is the one who is 11-0 -- excuse me 10-0, -- I'm about 24 hours ahead of myself. Your team got caught videotaping the JETS, yeah the lowly JETS. Do you a) lose sleep over it b) get really angry and alert the NFL or c) laugh your *** off? Yeah, I though so.

It's a sorry state in the NFL if people think that a season can turn on a single videotape or a bribe. Yeah, the NFL should investigate and report it, because the integrity of the game is at stake.

Blah blah blah! People need to get over it. It is WAY over. Things like this were happening with other teams besides the pats..so they did their time, its over, and they are still kicking butt so stop whining. Pull up your panties and take it!

Even Favre said that every team does what the Patriots do, he also said the Patriots just have the balls to go right in your face and do it. Honestly, Spygate, as said by just about every Football Analyst out there, is being blown way out of proportion. Madden admitted to doing it back in his day. So are all of Madden's wins tainted now? Stop being jealous, stop whining and crying and bitching because your team sucks. Maybe if Joe Horn could be a play maker and win his team some ballgames, he wouldn't have to draw attention to himself by talking about another team that he doesn't even play this season. And all the haters who post comments on here, when your team knocks the Pats off, if indeed that ever happens, then you can talk, but until then. Just shut your mouth, support your own team, and await your ass being handed to you, cause its inevitable.

nice one. thumbs up my friend.

Well said.